Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	6-May-04/3:46 AM
How is the "consciousness's corollary" reported? How is it timed in relation to chemical and electrical output of the brain? How do we know it is not some other aspect of consciousness that induces the brain to physically react in a certain way? As far as I know the scientific community is intrigued by these questions and no one has really drawn any solid conclusions about the source of consciousness.
Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	3-May-04/3:42 PM
Rich, are you saying that man's will, desires ,decisions and deepest contemplations are the mere product of physical cause and effect? Where does the artists vision come from? What is the source of the poets finely crafted work? Where is the scientific proof behid your assertion?
Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	2-May-04/10:37 AM
Zodie, Would you please relax? Why do you find it so difficult to refrain from personal insults? 1. When did I say that Christianity (I don't think I ever mentioned Christianity) appealed to me BECAUSE it teaches denial of worldly pleasures? 2. I said that if I did not have a soul and were left on my own to "artifically" construct a system of beliefs I would construct a system based soley on the desires of the flesh. But I do have a soul and that soul demands to be recognized and is at odds with the desires of the flesh. None of this is a matter of choice...it's just the way it is. What's the big deal? This is just the way I see it. We all have assumptions about the world, the existance of souls, and human nature. Why are you so caught up on mine? What is it that you believe in?
Re: a comment on Shame by Joe-joe	2-May-04/9:25 AM
Yeah, that too!
Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	2-May-04/9:25 AM
I raised the issue of pleasure in connection with your assertion that I hold the beliefs I hold becuase of the "challenge" it presents. No, if I believed in nothing, if I did not have a soul that truely spoke to me, but consciously felt the need to attach myself to "something", that something would be an affirmation not a denial of my flesh and blood desires. It would be 100% pleasure based. However, I do have a soul and it does speak to me. It distingusies between good and evil and it is often at odds with my conscious desires. It's a tough way to live..lots of guilt and anguish..but it is how I do see the world. "I don't think it's artificial because it can't be "captured in a test tube". I think it's artificial because there are no verification or falsification conditions for it." Your distinction escapes me.
Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	2-May-04/9:19 AM
I raised the issue of pleasure in connection with your assertion that I hold the beliefs I hold becuase of the "challenge" it presents. No, if I believed in nothing, if I did not have a soul that truely spoke to me, but consciously felt the need to attach myself to "something", that something would be an affirmation not a denial of my flesh and blood desires. It would be 100% pleasure based. However, I do have a soul and it does speak to me. It distingusies between good and evil and it is often at odds with my conscious desires. It's a tough way to live..lots of guilt and anguish..but it is how I do see the world. "I don't think it's artificial because it can't be "captured in a test tube". I think it's artificial because there are no verification or falsification conditions for it." Your distinction escapes me.
Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	2-May-04/9:09 AM
Zodie, I know it's difficult for you to put 2 and 2 together but I'll try: Quote from Dark Angel: "You seem determined to hold a theory which is demonstrably buncombe because it poses a "deeper challenge". You think that artificially imposing a grand cosmic structure on your life is a worthwhile thing to do". Interpretation: Darky says that my "theory" is concocted for the sake of a challenge that I seek. My response: If I were to "impose" an "artificial" (knowlingly false and without merit) grand cosmic scheme upon myself it certainly would not resemble the set of beliefs I currently hold. On the contrary, I would create a religion based on the pursuit of pure worldy pleasure...kinda like the religion working today through popular American Culture.
Re: Samurai by SupremeDreamer	2-May-04/6:06 AM
Payback is a bitch, isn't it?
Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	2-May-04/5:58 AM
What is a line break? I see nothing artificial about my "theory". Foolish as I may seem at times, I would dare not weigh my self down with a self-concocted system of beliefs that is at odds with my flesh and blood desires. Oh how much nicer it would be to live the life of a hedonist, giving into my every desire without giving thought to the eternal fate of my soul. You believe it is artificial because the spirit can not be seen through a microscope or captured in a test tube. That's fine with me. You say here that "the question is which theory better explains human nature". That was not my question it was yours. The piece I wrote was an expression of what it is I believe and what I've expereinced. There is no "question" and there is no "competition." But come on Darky admit it, there is a part of you that seeks for truth that is beyond your senses. I know the issue of God is one that you still wrestle with....admit it...it'll be our little secret.
Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	2-May-04/4:37 AM
"Humans are essentially chimpanzees with over-connected brains," talk about simplistic and shallow explanations! You've taken the easy way out Darky. "Well we're animals so it's expected that we will act like animals". I think we are much more than that and that our concept of the spirit is not an illusion produced by the brain but a core element of our being. It is that spirit that yearns for answers and seeks to connect with God. Now, you can totally reject this concept of our existence. I do understand your arguments....we live in an age of science...we believe everything that occurs in the world, including the formations of thoughts, emotions and concepts is a product of a physical cause and effect. There is no plane of consciousness beyond that produced by the chemical and electrical interactions of the brain. In fact the very thought that there is such consciousness is a fantasy concocted by the brain in response to some x, y and z stimuli. Fair enough. But let me tell you this Darky, it takes much more of a spine to live life according to my way of seeing things than it does yours. To you man is a robot....an assembly of flesh, blood and prefabricated wiring. He and the world he lives in are the product of random physical events...a conglomeration of cosmic elements brought together by chance. Because he is wired for consciousness he is aware of his own existence and mortality.....from there springs his need to explain his origins and the meaning of his existence (hence religion). His life is a purely physical phenomenon...he lives, he dies...end of story. Is that how is kinda goes Darky? Life with no challenge and no purpose, no acknowledgment of that which lies beyond the physical world of our senses, denial of our innate desire to connect with and awareness of our source...this Darky is the life of the spineless coward who refuses to accept the deeper challenges of human existence but who rather chooses to say "I am but a top-of-the-shelf chimpanzee, why bother exploring the meaning of it all?” Spineless I tell you…spineless!
Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	1-May-04/5:07 PM
Darky, I don't think I've summed up all of the "important facts" but I do think that we've all made life a whole lot more complicated and painful than it needs to be. A little more love, compassion, and charity would go a long long way towards making this world a better place to live in. We are in the mess we're in because we are ruled by the urges and desires of our ego and flesh and completely ignore our spirtitual nature. Now if you disagree with these assertions your problem is not with me but with some of the greatest spiritual and philosophical thinkers of all time.
Re: a comment on Shame by Joe-joe	1-May-04/4:34 PM
I never said that we must sin...but when we do sin it is shame that leads us back to God.
Re: a comment on deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	1-May-04/4:31 PM
Give me some of examples of those "wishy washy platitudes".
Re: deviant conveniences by J.B. Manning	1-May-04/1:10 PM
JB, Why the infatuation with the vile and depraved? There is more to life than unencumbered sexual desire. Your writing could be so much better if not for your lack of emotional depth and maturity.
Re: a comment on Shame by Joe-joe	1-May-04/11:15 AM
The shadow of darkness cast from ones shame is a gift. It reminds us of just how far we've drifted from our spiritual nature and how removed we are from the path of life that leads to true freedom and peace. I know I'm leaving myself open here for those who might argue that "shame" is a cultural based emotion that is relative to ones customs and system of belief. But I do believe there is a truth that resonates in all beings and it is to this universally experienced truth that this poem speaks. "You" is God...however you define him/her/it....as a conscious life force or an unconscious source of energy.
Re: "Joseph, Joseph" by joe-joe	29-Apr-04/2:44 PM
Horus, I agree. The buns are not totally bad but there certainly is quite a bit of room for improvement. Suggestions are welcome. Thanks.
Re: "Joseph, Joseph" by Joe-joe	29-Apr-04/2:42 PM
Horus, I agree. I'll need to give it somne more thought. Thanks.
Re: saltwater bath by J.B. Manning	28-Apr-04/4:22 PM
The Law of Diminishing Returns asserts that marginal gains in profit begin to decrease at a certain point of production and that this reduction continues as more output is produced until marginal gains are actually negative (negative returns). I believe that this princiiple is actually at play with regard to your work which continues to be highly fragmented and disjointed, lacks originality and is agonizingly melodramatic. It all smells so much like a sorry assed soap opera...Hey but who am I to judge you .....my writing sucks too. Peace Joe-Joe
Re: a comment on A Proclamation to Our Lord by Joe-joe	26-Apr-04/8:19 AM
I will personally pray to the Master to grant forgiveness for the blasphemy that has passed your lips. No the treasure is not a promise to be hoped for...for it sits quietly in view well within your reach. But you are a hard man with a hard heart hiding behind a wall of venom and resentment, all the while crying for the Lord you’ve forsaken to rescue you from yourself. I see and feel your pain my brother. Peace. Joe-joe
Re: a comment on A Proclamation to Our Lord by Joe-joe	26-Apr-04/7:59 AM
Ah Darky, you have once again cut to the essence of it all and, might I say, in a vestovious and utterly tildaneous manner that has shed new and hitherto unseen light upon He whose words you perspire. Beautiful!